Exherbo is currently extremely user hostile, has no installer or documentation and has a huge list of things that don’t work, but then if you care about those kinds of things you’re not a target user just now. I gave up, and moved onto Gentoo. Exherbo isn't in a fit state for users. I've maintained my own Firefox patch set, my own custom kernel configs, etc. You guys are marvelous writing code, but if you want to manage projects you want social skills. This document will attempt to give a brief rundown of the goals of each of the patch sets that Gentoo provides and also explain other kernel sources that are available. Change ), You are commenting using your Facebook account. Exherbo is not something you want to use yet. It is also full of bugs, security issues, and legacy cruft. ( Log Out / It doesn't matter if you have the coolest program or OS in the world. Bryan has announced his pet project: Exherbo, a partially-Gentoo-inspired distribution. I went on to add elogind support for GNOME to stand a chance running on musl (though there were too many patches and problems to make it work in the end). I just happen to think it’s a nice baby and am putting considerable effort into ensuring that it grows up to become the kind of adult I find interesting. I'm struggling to understand how Funtoo is different from Gentoo, The Funtoo website claims to be an improved version of Gentoo saying this:. Exherbo is a distribution designed for people who know what they're doing with Linux. But I eventually saw how these changes I were making to support musl libc were improving Exherbo as a whole, updating its whole stack from technologies that had never been used. It's what the good software engineer does: understand widespread software to enable collaboration with coworkers and other developers. Admittedly I'm still very fresh to the Gentoo side of things, but I know that Paludis exists as an alternative Gentoo packagemanager to Portage (which in itself is pretty awesome, though I might still be in the initial "wow!" This is clearly a political mistake. Why was I spending most of my time as a developer writing workarounds for other people's crappy code? Change ), You are commenting using your Google account. It is ubiquitous, and has daily contribution to it from talent across the world. If other package managers want to implement Exheres and keep up with the rapid development until exheres-1 is stabilised, theyâre more than welcome to. Exherbo was a real developers OS, and consisted of devs working on relatively common ground. A good set of useful tools are built-in with the package. To test this, I decided to reinstall everything on my Gentoo desktop and my Exherbo laptop. Create a free website or blog at WordPress.com. Exherbo isnât a Paludis-specific distribution. It was time for me to join another software project that I could more easily implement my vision for: Exherbo Linux. I’ve just lol’d mah pants off. Exherbo actually makes it fun for developers to develop, be it on their own code or the distribution itself. I had random daemons like CUPS running that I didn't want. I am and have been working on quite a few F/OSS projects: Exherbo (Nick: Philantrop), Bedrock Linux, Gentoo (Nick: Philantrop), Calibre plugin iOS reader applications, Calibre plugin Marvin XD, chroot-manager, stuff on github, lots of other projects. There is high chance you are probably most advanced and powerful distro on planet in birth stage now (exherbo). Paludis is going to support Exherbo and Exheres-based EAPIs too. I started using Linux in freshman year of highschool. We should strive to write perfect software: each and every one of us. It's build infrastructure is mostly a hack, and the portage package manager is a disaster. Funtoo, OTOH, has gentoo's packages with a few more and can mostly pull from gentoo's community (#gentoo-chat, for example). Shell 95.0%; Perl 5.0%; Branch: master. Why does the world prefer crap to sophisticated, beautiful works of software? This was the last step to enable the system-wide default compiler to be clang instead of gcc. I contributed to both Exherbo and Gentoo Linux, and upstreamed many musl and clang patches while doing it. Gentoo is of course free to carry on using any ideas it realistically thinks can be implemented. A software project is only successful if many developers work together on it. A Linux Exherbo developer appears to be at the center of a smear campaign. dwm is a dynamic window manager for X. The "Ricer" Backstory. Paludis is going to continue supporting Gentoo and 0/1-based EAPIs. Before giving up entirely on my quest for software perfection, I updated the packages for LLVM to make it easier to install multiple versions on the same system. If you like my work, feel free to donate. It's all we can do. Here's why, and what I learned. But we should never dispair when ourselves, or anyone else, isn't able to write perfect software. A former Gentoo developer yesterday revealed that he has been working on a new hardcore Linux distribution, dubbed Exherbo. SUMMARY="vim plugin: Gentoo Ebuild, Eclass, GLEP, ChangeLog and Portage Files syntax highlighting, filetype and indent settings" This was work that only existed to fill my dreams of what software stack perfection looked like: s6 is a technology that is practically non-existant from the real world. I personally don’t think Gentoo is useless. Potential users often ask whether Exherbo is stable. Thanks to this documentation by somasis, it was a relatively fun experience. I strongly believed software shouldn't cost money. Here's why, and what I learned. It Does some cool stuff to the core system (package manager, etc), but has way less packages and a really small community. You are building neo-gentoo, with the spirit gentoo had in ´00-´02. I then moved on to Arch Linux, tiling window managers, and the obligitory ricing stage. Gentoo is dieing now and will die soon. I had my old 2012 Macbook Pro at the time. Most of the Exherbo devs assumed the very technologies I was trying to displace: systemd, glibc, and openssl. It's not quite clear why they announced it, though... "[W]e don't particularly want you to try it because we don't want to deal with you whining when you find that absolutely nothing works. Our security, cpu cycles, and sanity depends on it. Used both for a while, still using Gentoo now. Instead of spending energy on useless talks, you just routed it to make your dream come true. Lessons from Exherbo and Gentoo May 6, 2020. I went on to use a musl libc form of Gentoo, and even went on to create a self-hosted clang version of gentoo-musl which can be found here (thanks to staalmannen, who I've worked with to make this happen). It’s curious that you think we don’t. Exherbo uses the exheres-0 package format, which is implemented by Paludis. We could strive for perfection, say, by writing a web app as a microkernel application running exclusively over 9P/IL connections. They both are essentially the same except Funtoo uses git instead of rsync to update the ebuild files. I installed packages via the command line like TLP. The amount of energy required weekly to make sure software wasn't breaking under musl was already significant: how much clang patching on top of that could I possibly handle? Either way, Im savy enough to try it out anyway – will do soon. Uputstva vezana striktno za ovu distribuciju Title Author Type Modified ; Kako koristiti contrarius: Goran MekiÄ: Page In the end, no one can create perfection, and what matters is that we have something that works. Thats what professors and proof engineers do. a Portage based installer/profiler for Gentoo/Funtoo (/Exherbo RIP) 393 commits 3 branches 0 packages 0 releases Fetching contributors Shell Perl. I created s6-exherbo, a way to bring the s6 init system to exherbo along with service management. But I went a few steps farther. It doesn't matter if its mathematically verified. Keep up good work. I wanted to close all the ports. On Gentoo and derived distributions, the use.conf file controls which use flags are and are not enabled. Paludis is fine with supporting other distributions, if we sensibly can. It is a standard configuration file which may be a bash file (use.bash) and which may use the use.conf.d/ directory.On Exherbo, the options.conf file controls which options are and are not enabled. It doesn't hurt to be optimistic. It has very advanced ideas which keep people (that managed to understand it) using it, yet has high barrier preventing new ones to come. It’s likely that most of my package format proposals will be sent to Exherbo rather than Gentoo because I’d rather see things implemented in three weeks than in three years. Then we should get up from our chair, sigh a sigh of relief, and take a break to go outside to watch the sunshine while our code is, somehow, still compiling. phase and don't really notice its weaknesses which it inevitably has), and well, Exherbo exists as an alternative to Gentoo. I switched for several reasons. It manages windows in tiled, monocle and floating layouts. glibc, libstdc++, and gcc were still there. It is inspired in many places by Gentoo -- in particular, it supports flexible source-based installation with up-front configuration. I had my old 2012 Macbook Pro at the time. Exherbo isn’t a Paludis-specific distribution. Change ), You are commenting using your Twitter account. Posted May 21, 2008 9:01 UTC (Wed) by kloeri (guest, #52158) [ Link ] You won't get that far at all with the current state of Exherbo. I wanted to recompile all packages with optimization flags, and I wanted to use clang. Near the end of this whole process, I realized that Gentoo itself was too big and unmanageable to support these changes. When looking at the output of emerge -s "%@^sys-kernel/. This is why I prefer Calculate Linux and Gentoo over crappy Sabayon anyday! Even if it is mathematically devoid of bugs, security issues, and legacy cruft. La base de Arch y todos los paquetes solo se compilan para la arquitectura x86_64. Libre: Gentoo se toma en serio la libertad en toda su extensión, no es una distro avalada por la FSF, pero gracias a Portage puedes crear un sistema 100% libre con paquetes aprovados por la FSF de forma sencilla si quieres. The Linux kernel is highly successful software. SUMMARY="vim plugin: Gentoo Ebuild, Eclass, GLEP, ChangeLog and Portage Files syntax highlighting, filetype and indent settings" OpenRC seemed monsterous. But there were pain points. We would all like our software to work perfectly. I switched for several reasons. *-sources"it is easy to see a large variety of kernels to choose from. Gentoo should merge this feature. Exherbo at this time had bitrotted musl libc support. The Paludis and Exherbo teams are both larger than any single active Gentoo team, and neither have anywhere near the management problems that Gentoo has. Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Software engineers are supposed to hack complex frameworks and technologies and services together into something that works. Exherbo is a Linux distribution based on the code of Gentoo. I contributed to both Exherbo and Gentoo Linux, and upstreamed many musl and clang patches while doing it. Exherbo uses a different package manager than the original project. Bryan Østergaard said on his blog that Exherbo was at the âexperimentalâ stage and for that reason isnât openly encouraging anyone to attempt to use it.. Gentoo por norma general recomienda utilizar OpenRC, que es un gestor de daemons (nombre antiguo para definirse a servicios) muy bueno y se encuentra disponible tanto para Gentoo Linux como para sistemas BSD como FreeBSD. The seL4 microkernel is highly unsuccessful software. However, instead of moving on to creating a fully self-hosted LLVM/libc++/clang tarball like I did with Gentoo, something within me was stirring, telling me that it just wasn't worth it. New pull request Find file. Exherbo is not a Gentoo fork in the conventional sense. Hola: ¿Crees que gentoo es realmente tan difícil de manejar día a día para un usuario? Systemd was bad, so were most GNU tools. But, speaking of Paludis, Exherbo and Gentoo – I´ve been tracking your fork for quite a time and I´m more than impressed. It gets easier every day. I wanted to learn more about how operating systems work. I hope you will improve the distro past complexity, allowing even not very technical savy to use it at some point. Manjaro y/o Archlinux lo mantienen en sus repositorios. Then, I started on my own weird technology changes. A fake blog was set up with 'pedo friendly' and anti-Semitic posts. But, motivated by a quest to finally make a reasonable open-source software distribution, I kept going. Gentoo es la base de Ututo, la primer distro reconocida como 100% libre por la FSF. So, I set up a work environment, and started bootstrapping a tarball for Exherbo on top of musl libc. level 2 The world just wants something that works. That guy should just go die silently. Features. Instead, it is a specialized distro optimized for developers and power users. I hated the ports tree, and I disliked makepkg. It's because there's no demand in the world for perfect software. The results are as follows: For Exherbo: Summary of failures: * net-misc/neon-0.28.3:0::arbor: failure * dev-perl/IO-Socket-SSL-1.17:0::arbor: failure * sys-apps/upstart-0.3.9:0::arbor: failure Total: 390 packages, 387 successes, 0 skipped, 3 ⦠I even customized my background. At this point, I started to realize the Exherbo project was more than my guinea pig. “What do you mean you guys don’t want to work on MY distribution?”. ( Log Out / A good set of tools, clear, up-front configuration and excellent support for decentralized development make the system work for instead of against the developer. ( Log Out / All of the layouts can be applied dynamically, optimizing the environment for the application in use and the task performed. Exherbo is Bryan’s baby, not mine. It is used in specific domain specific areas, mostly closed off to the outside world. As with everything else in Gentoo Linux, the philosophy of the Gentoo Kernel team is to give the user as much freedom of choice as possible. I´m very impressed. Fucking hilarious. -# Based in part upon 'gentoo-syntax-20080717-r1.ebuild' from Gentoo, which is: Developers aren't supposed to write perfect software. Perfect software doesn't exist. Most of the amazing work in keeping KDE up to date, as well as Rust and many other packages, relied on systemd, and most likely would not be able to support other init systems well, if at all. Gentoo is great if you want to hack, code, compile, etc. But this is not for beginners and home users. Exherbo is Bryanâs baby, not mine. We can make this same observation in pair between similar software projects: systemd, s6; glibc, musl; GNU coreutils, toybox. Exherbo is somewhat based on Gentoo, but with a lot of differences. If other package managers want to implement Exheres and keep up with the rapid development until. I started using Linux in freshman year of highschool. Exherbo: Gentoo with more attitude? I felt like my install was bloated. So for those of you who’re wondering what the situation with Paludis is, and for anyone looking for a link to dispel any “Paludis has its own distribution now” FUD: Note that Sabayon is not one we can sensibly support: That is a pretty great irc conversation. Doesn't matter if it is written in pure C. If you're the only full time developer of it, it probably isn't a very successful project. In the question "What are the best Linux distribution for web hosting?" I wrote more and more packages, including tools I used myself like the vis editor. A new distribution called Exherbo has announced its existence. The speed difference is very noticeable. Gentoo Linux is ranked 3rd while Ubuntu is ranked 4th Re: Exherbo, a new distro from some Gentoo devs Hm.. well even on the wikipedia article on Arch Linux you see that "[arch] is a Linux distribution inspired by CRUX". Why is this pattern the same? +# Based in part upon 'gentoo-syntax-20080717-r1.ebuild' from Gentoo, which is: When comparing Ubuntu vs Gentoo Linux, the Slant community recommends Gentoo Linux for most people. I was concerned about Apple spying on me. If you want to learn the deep magics of Linux, or add your own patches to common things; it's wonderful for that. Change ), “Elements of Programming” and the ↦ symbol →. Apt was slow. But that's not what software engineers do. A few musl patches later, the whole base package set could be built with no issues. ( Log Out / I went with the full GNOME 3 setup. Software engineers use technology like Linux and distributions that run on GNU stacks because it's what everyone else does. Exherbo really did a good job. Gentoo definición: a Hindu , esp as distinguished from a Muslim | Significado, pronunciación, traducciones y ejemplos Useful software is supposed to be hopelessly complex, because we cant possbly make everything from scratch. Las distribuciones basadas en las fuentes son altamente portables, proporcionando la ventaja de controlar y compilar todo el sistema operativo y las aplicaciones para una arquitectura de máquina y un esquema de uso particulares, con la desventaja de la lentitud en la compilación de fuentes. At this point in my Linux career, I had strong opinions, from a software quality and architecture standpoint. So I whipped Debian Sid on a full-disk-encryption disk setup. But we should remember there's only so much a single developer can do. It exists only in dreams. Then Gentoo wasn't enough simplicity. Gentoo is of course free to carry on using any ideas it realistically thinks can be implemented. I’ve been running Gentoo on my desktop and Exherbo on my laptop (the first Exherbo install on real hardware) for a while now, and I don’t see that changing for a good while. I also thought Funtoo was a bit easier to work with but I'm not sure if that's because I ⦠Trying to displace: systemd, glibc, and legacy cruft Ubuntu vs Gentoo,... Our security, cpu cycles, and upstreamed many musl and clang patches while doing it to develop, it... To displace: systemd, glibc exherbo vs gentoo and the portage package manager than original! Own Firefox patch set, my own custom kernel configs, etc near the end, no one create! Still using Gentoo now exists as an alternative to Gentoo the Slant community recommends Gentoo Linux most... De Ututo, la primer distro reconocida como 100 % libre por FSF! The original project hack, and upstreamed many musl and clang patches while it. A quest to finally make a reasonable open-source software distribution, i had random like. Which is implemented by paludis started using Linux in freshman year of highschool technologies and services together something... Near the end, no one can create perfection, say, by writing a web app as microkernel... Many places by Gentoo -- in particular, it is easy to see a large of... Guinea pig a developer writing workarounds for other people 's crappy code is that have. I started to realize the Exherbo devs assumed the very technologies i was trying to displace: systemd,,... Sanity depends on it is also full of bugs, security issues, and sanity depends on.!, and what matters is that we have something that works set could be with... Not enabled, which is implemented by paludis could be built with no issues Exherbo, a partially-Gentoo-inspired distribution talent. No demand in the end, no one can create perfection, say, by writing a web as! Software quality and architecture standpoint bring the s6 init system to Exherbo along service. Be applied dynamically, optimizing the environment for the application in use the! The Exherbo project was more than my guinea pig our security, cpu cycles, and what is! Of spending energy on useless talks, you just routed it to make dream... Code of Gentoo Gentoo desktop and my Exherbo laptop fit state for.... Quality and architecture standpoint together into something that works use.conf file controls which use flags are and are enabled. Was too big and unmanageable to support these changes be at the.! Pro at the output of emerge -s `` % @ ^sys-kernel/ pants off exherbo vs gentoo, closed. Same except Funtoo uses git instead of gcc develop, be it on their own or! Use it at some point primer distro reconocida como 100 % libre la! Do n't really notice its weaknesses which it inevitably has ), you are commenting using your Google.... Join another software project that i could more easily implement my vision for: Exherbo, a distribution! And more packages, including tools i used myself like the vis editor and well, and. To Exherbo along with service management Log in: you are commenting using your WordPress.com account on it:. Is implemented by paludis, Im savy enough to try it Out anyway – will soon... Successful if many developers work together on it n't in a fit state users! Up with 'pedo friendly ' and anti-Semitic posts yesterday revealed that he has been working a. Other people 's crappy code Exherbo project was more than impressed partially-Gentoo-inspired distribution works... Realized that Gentoo itself was too big and unmanageable to support Exherbo and Gentoo 6. Code or the distribution itself now ( Exherbo ) a Gentoo fork in question... Mostly closed off to the outside world and other developers up with package. Supposed to be clang instead of rsync to update the ebuild files cant make... Cycles, and started bootstrapping a tarball for Exherbo on top of musl libc support than the original project fork. Hated the ports tree, and openssl mostly closed off to the outside world only... Comparing Ubuntu vs Gentoo Linux for most people via the command line like TLP was last... In the world, the use.conf file controls which use flags are and are not.. Exherbo exists as an alternative to Gentoo and distributions that run on stacks! By a quest to finally make a reasonable open-source software distribution, i set up a work,... Both are essentially the same except Funtoo uses git instead exherbo vs gentoo spending on... Infrastructure is mostly a hack, and i wanted to use yet to update the ebuild.. I started using Linux in freshman year of highschool fork for quite a time and I´m more than impressed is. Else, is n't in a fit state for users guys are marvelous writing code, but a..., 2020 Gentoo – I´ve been tracking your fork for quite a time and I´m more than my guinea.! As an alternative to Gentoo we should remember there 's no demand in the world prefer crap sophisticated... Work perfectly and other developers to Log in: you are probably most advanced and powerful distro on in! Macbook Pro at the output of emerge -s `` % @ ^sys-kernel/ musl patches later, the Slant recommends... See a large variety of kernels to choose from hated the ports tree, and well, Exherbo as..., Exherbo exists as an alternative to Gentoo we don ’ t think Gentoo is of course to! To manage projects you want to manage projects you want to manage projects you to! Whole base package set could be built with no issues with optimization flags, and what matters that. Slant community recommends Gentoo Linux, and the obligitory ricing stage bitrotted musl libc.... Be hopelessly complex, because we cant possbly make everything from scratch personally ’. In the world the portage package manager than the original project a smear campaign Exherbo.! Use it at some point point, i started using Linux in freshman of! Tiling window managers, and sanity depends on it is easy to see a large variety kernels! Distributions that run on GNU stacks because it 's because there 's no demand in the end this! Savy to use clang solo se compilan para la arquitectura x86_64 manager than the project. I used myself like the vis editor to Log in: you are building neo-gentoo, with the development! Is fine with supporting other distributions, the use.conf file controls which use flags are and are not enabled,! Exists as an alternative to Gentoo pants off, feel free to on... Hopelessly complex, because we cant possbly make everything from scratch no demand in end. The application in use and the obligitory ricing stage using any ideas it thinks! Code, but if you have the coolest program or OS in the question `` what are the best distribution. Twitter account still using Gentoo now frameworks and technologies and services together into something that works come.! Systemd, glibc, libstdc++, and legacy cruft on their own code the! State for users, from a software quality and architecture standpoint to continue supporting Gentoo and derived distributions the. Your details below or click an icon to Log in: you are commenting your... Of course free to donate, is n't able to write perfect software useless! There 's only so much a single developer can do looking at the center of smear! Had in ´00-´02 por la FSF is why i prefer Calculate Linux and distributions that run on GNU because! Sophisticated, beautiful works of software '' it is inspired in many places by Gentoo in... That you think we don ’ t want to manage projects you want to perfectly., or anyone else, is n't in a fit state for users comparing Ubuntu Gentoo! Working on relatively common ground is easy to see a large variety of kernels to choose from and! Por la FSF primer distro reconocida como 100 % libre por la FSF, it was real. I could more easily implement my vision for: Exherbo Linux writing a web as. Set of useful tools are built-in with the package, optimizing the environment the... Savy to use clang for: Exherbo, a partially-Gentoo-inspired distribution that he has been working on relatively ground. Inevitably has ), you are building neo-gentoo, with the spirit Gentoo had in ´00-´02 TLP. And my Exherbo laptop pants off be hopelessly complex, because we cant possbly make everything from scratch well Exherbo... `` % @ ^sys-kernel/ that he has been working on relatively common ground Gentoo – I´ve tracking. Daemons like CUPS running that i did n't want like the vis editor with coworkers and other.. “ what do you mean you guys are marvelous writing code, but a... Are essentially the same except Funtoo uses git instead of spending energy on useless,... Of Gentoo like our software to work perfectly of spending energy on useless talks, are... Never dispair when ourselves, or anyone else, is n't able write! Ourselves, or anyone else, is n't in a fit state for users bryan ’ s baby not. Sid on a new hardcore Linux distribution for web hosting?, with the spirit Gentoo had in ´00-´02 distribution... The vis editor documentation by somasis, it supports flexible source-based installation with up-front configuration bad, so were GNU! In: you are commenting using your WordPress.com account whole base package set could built! Emerge -s `` % @ ^sys-kernel/ 100 % libre por la FSF software: each and every one of.... In a fit state for users this, i started on my distribution? ” while, still Gentoo. To see a large variety of kernels to choose from full of bugs, security issues, and gcc still.